How to Silence the Mom Guilt & Stop Putting So Much Pressure On Yourself

Trish: [00:00:00] My name is Trish Ware and I am obsessed with all things pregnancy and birth and helping you to navigate with the practical and the magical seasons of this journey called motherhood. I'm an all day coffee sipping mama of seven. I've had the amazing privilege of delivering many babies in my 15 plus year career as a labor and delivery nurse and as a mama of seven. 


I'm here to help you take the guesswork out of childbirth so you can make the choices that are right for you and your baby. Quick note, this podcast is for educational purposes only and does not replace your medical advice. Check out our full disclaimer at the bottom of the show notes. 


Hello everyone. I am so excited about today's topic. We are going to break [00:01:00] down Mom guilt. So if you're pregnant, don't worry. You probably are already experiencing it anyway, so you may just not have named it yet, but I promise at some point you will experience if you haven't yet. And today's guest is Anna and she is from Chicago's Family Doulas. 


I hope I just said that I go family do as yes. Awesome. I got tongue tied for a minute. Anyway, Anna is going to be with us and we're just gonna have a conversation about mom guilt because unfortunately It plays a huge role in your journey, and I've been a mama for a very long time, and I really don't know any other moms who haven't experienced it in one form or fashion. 


So welcome, Anna. Can you just tell everyone a little bit about you, your journey into motherhood, and [00:02:00] owning your own business? 


Anna: Yes, absolutely. Thanks so much for letting me be on here, Trish, and talk to your amazing mamas that you have built this incredible community. I'm so appreciative. Yeah, so I own Chicago Family Doulas. 


It's a full service doula agency in the Chicagoland area. So we have labor doulas, postpartum doulas childbirth educators, and I actually was a special ed teacher before starting my doula career. I've been a doula now for about 14 years and I started my business pretty much while I was pregnant with my first realizing how incredibly amazing And yeah, it was just a life changing situation for me, but yes, absolutely. 


My mom guilt started in pregnancy [00:03:00] and it's a, I would say it's a daily, multiple times a day internal dialogue that I have about, should I feel bad about this or should I stand my ground about this? And and it's pretty amazing that I've. been able to connect with so many moms over the years. Our agency has grown quite a bit and we have about 150 doulas. 


So that means I have this awesome opportunity to support thousands of moms every single year, which is You know, I hear a lot and I talk a lot of moms down from all their big feelings. 


Trish: Yes, I totally get you. I was just saying to my mamas, which I was telling you before we started recording. That inside my membership, we're on our own app and I can go live inside of there. 


And so can my team. And [00:04:00] so I found myself the last week or two going live first thing in the morning and just hanging out with some of these mamas as we're getting ready for work and getting ready for our days. And I have hung out with postpartum mamas more. I've had a labor nurse than I ever have because we recover you and we send you on your merry way after two hours. 


So up until recently, my experience with postpartum has mostly been like anyone else who's had a baby because. I've had six, so it's just been a postpartum mom. So I have learned so much from my community. So this morning, spinky dove, I told my mamas that I was going to be hanging out with you and talking about. 


Mom guilt, and we had a really amazing conversation. So I'm super excited [00:05:00] about some of the things you and I are gonna talk about. So I guess I wanna dive right in and just get to those things. So why don't you explain to everyone what exactly is mom guilt and why do most partners or fathers. not experience 


Anna: it? 


Yeah, that's a big question. So mom guilt is this. Overwhelming feeling of anxiousness, not being enough guilt, just feeling bad about what we can't accomplish or that our interactions with our kiddos weren't the best and we weren't 100% in everything that we did. And it usually revolves around. Kids, your children, but it could also be household stuff. 


It could also be not cooking [00:06:00] dinners that are amazing and consistent, really all the things that change from all the roles that change from being not a parent to a mom. So I think it looks, similar in a lot of ways for most people. It's just feeling bad and overwhelmed and. Not good enough, but it could also, look like anxiety. 


It could also look like, defeat . So I think there's varying levels. 


Trish: The postpartum side of the community took us by surprise that we've done a lot of research and put a lot of heart and soul into it. And I think with mom guilt and spec specifically, there's this sense of, I. I'm not being perfect or I'm not doing all the right things. 


I'm going to cause future harm or not do enough for this child. And I think there's also. [00:07:00] a Friend that comes along with that guilt, which is shame. Oh, yeah, absolutely They're like best buddies like hand in hand. I'm guilty now I'm shameful and you're right like it morphs and it changes minute by minute sometimes One minute you're fined Telling your kids like go watch a TV program. 


I need some time alone. And then you're like, oh my god I should have spent time with them. Like why did I need time alone? And then you're like I need more time alone because if I don't have time alone and it's like this Thing so why? Like, why do our husbands, why do the fathers not feel this 


Anna: way? 


Yeah, I think it's so complicated, but I feel like social pressures social expectations and those cause expectations that they have of themselves. I just had this conversation with my husband the other day. He texted my 13 [00:08:00] year old. Two times in a day, and he said me and Jules have been communicating all day and I was like, Oh, really? 


That's awesome. What were you guys talking about? And he's yeah, just different things. And then I look at my daughter's phone and as we're talking, I'm like, Oh, it's awesome. You were chatting with your dad today. She's no, what are you talking about? I just texted him back twice. And into my, in my husband's eyes, that was enough and that was a good relationship with our 13 year old who I intentionally have conversations, in the car, I'm like, please put your phone away. 


Let's talk. Let's chat about the day. Because that's when I have her captive but even with that, I'm like, okay, I talked to Jules for only 17 minutes today. That's not enough. I'm like calculating what is enough. Yeah. And for him, enough was. [00:09:00] Literally two text messages and I with six words. 


Yeah, exactly. And it's interesting, like the expectations that I think our partners, especially husbands put on themselves versus what we put on ourselves. Much 


Trish: lower 


Anna: probably. Yeah. And then society. I was making a joke about this the other day, but my husband will take the kids to the park. Once a month and he gets 20 compliments like, Oh, wow, that's so great that you're involved. 


And, oh, that's nice. Where's your wife? What do you, what is she doing? And I don't know if anyone has ever told me that even if I take them to the park every single day. Nobody's been like, 


Trish: where's your, yeah. No. Okay. So funny that you said that because I asked, I had gone over some of the things that you sent and some of the things that I wanted to ask you. 


And I, so my, a little bit of my backstory, I was married for a very long time to one person, no [00:10:00] longer married to him, married to the most incredible human I have ever met in my life. And he's never been married, never had kids, along comes me with seven. 


Anna: That's already amazing. You got me there. 


Trish: I, yeah, I had my last at 42 when him and I started talking, he's Oh, is that your grandchild? No. That's mine. So surprise, surprise. You get to raise a child or two and a teenage girl and a teenage girl, which he's incredible. He's done an amazing job. But. That being said, I think He communicates in a way that I've never experienced. 


My father did not communicate the way that he does. He communicates. He tells me what he's feeling, how he's feeling. Sometimes he can, he's communicates his feelings way better than I do. But that and so we were talking this morning about this when I was asking my mamas and we were If saying, agreed with what [00:11:00] you said, there's so many more expectations from other women. 


Like you said, it's not other dads coming up asking him, where's the mom, why are you a thug? It's women. So it's coming from other women and the other thing is we are typically built to be nurturers, built to be the carers and. Our husbands a lot of times see things less emotionally and more logically. 


And so I think for Steve, when we are having a situation or a discipline thing or whatever, he's able to not take it personally or emotionally. And I would say he 100% Parents with, we've been together three years now, and Grayson was, he's going, he's eight now, so we've been together for a while, and he still stays a lot less emotional than I [00:12:00] do in this situation, and I can't tell you big or small, I'm like, Oh my god, this is because of me, I've failed, YouTube show. 


I should not have done this. I should not have I'm way back and he's just very logical and move forward and, and so we were talking about this in the community that, we're different, like, how we approach situations are different, but you the whole park thing triggered one thing we talked about, and that was one thing that's bothered me from the get go, and I started my journey very young, but why is it that when I want to go somewhere. 


It's I need to get a babysitter when our husbands want to go. So yeah, like they just go they don't have to get a babysitter and they don't say my wife's watching the kids for me to go out tonight Or any of that stuff, like we have to say oh yeah, my husband's watching the kids so I can do this tonight or [00:13:00] whatever. 


It's just a weird, it's a weird thing. So I was telling my girls, have those conversations while you're pregnant. Figure those things out. We didn't do that. We didn't have those conversations. We set ourselves up for some of those. So we just got off on a whole nother podcast 


Anna: topic. Absolutely. No, I think that all the time I say it to my husband, I'm like, it's funny. It's funny. You leave or go to work or go upstairs to take a shower. You don't have to make that announcement to anyone. But when I do any of those things, Hey, I need to run to the gas station really quickly, or I'm going to walk across the street to my mom's I have to make those announcements and I have to figure out all the logistics of things. And I say have to, and now I'm like questioning myself, but those are, that's what I think a lot of families set up for themselves. And that perpetuates this mom guilt of it all falls on us. 


And if things aren't perfect. [00:14:00] Then, we have to fix it. As opposed to it's this entire family's responsibility to figure things out. And to, and you're right, it's certainly something that you talk about ahead of time and then it's these ongoing conversations and one of my friends works with a therapist and she was saying that her and her husband, and I think this is just a strategy that probably a lot of therapists use where they like write down. 


Everything that needs to happen in the household, all the tasks that need to be done and they look at it and say, okay which parts of these are my true responsibility and you can't do and then what parts are your responsibility and then how do we divide up the rest of the things and it really creates this awareness of responsibility that, I think just a lot of, partners don't necessarily have and It all just perpetuates this feeling of not being enough [00:15:00] because we're trying to be so much 


Trish: right. 


Yeah. And, the other thing that I was talking to them about this morning, one of the first workshops we had, because as because you came in and did a workshop, we do weekly workshops in the community. All sorts of topics, from trying to conceive, we've had fertility specialists, all the way to about one to two years postpartum, one of them was accepting imperfect help, and that was really I'm eight years postpartum, for me, that was really good to hear because I have a really hard time with just doing it all. 


Cause I do it quick and good and fast and I'm get it done. And so I would say that. And I was telling them that even, my husband is so sweet, he makes the bed almost every weekday, and, I have a lot of [00:16:00] stuff on my bed. Like I, I got a lot of stuff. And a lot of times he'll leave some things off, and a few times I've been like, why didn't you put those on? 


He's Because you always fix them or say something about it. And I was like, Oh, I'm still struggling with this. So for those of you guys listening, like really get in a habit of accepting help. That's not as good as you would do in your don't say that out loud. It just accept it. And I think that too, in the parenting. 


Realm a lot of times like we've had this baby or and I have a daughter who's adopted as well So I was the same way with her I felt like I could just do it better and quicker and I just instinctively knew what I was doing And so I just did it and I think that we have to hand off The care, and as long as it's safe, that's important, as long as someone's doing something safe, namely your partner, let them do it their way. 


So [00:17:00] what if they do the diaper, as long as the poo's not gonna come out everywhere, and everything's good, and they're safe, then let them do it their way. Even if it's the strangest way you've ever seen anyone put a diaper on, it's okay. You know cuz you never know I've seen some weird stuff in the labor room, you know I'm the one I'm the one that's usually teaching Partners how to do that first diaper change. 


So I always just I just really say let them do it their way, and the more critical you are, the more you, don't accept their help the way they're bringing it, the more insecure they get, and they're just going to stop doing it, and then you're doing more. 


Anna: And I think you bring up a huge point. 


This starts immediately. And those habits, with both parents, say that both parents are off of work, if there are two parents, for two weeks, four [00:18:00] weeks, six weeks, whatever it is, that you have two people there learning and growing together. And if in that time, with all that help, you're taking it all on, not letting them do things, that's the pattern that gets set up for. 


And 


Trish: you will resent it. And you 


Anna: will resent it. Oh yeah. Absolutely. Whether it's, you're noticing it right away or, even five years from now, whatever it is, there will be like a breaking point where it's wait a minute, I have too much stress. And. No wonder I can't be perfect or I have all this guilt about all the stress. 


I'm doing way too much. Yeah, I've had some really good friends point that out to me and help me, and I think that's a big part of, what we need as women, as really good friends that are like, why are you 


Trish: doing all those things? Yeah, I've gotten myself in trouble [00:19:00] being that person because sometimes the truth comes out really fast and unfiltered and so I've had to learn with age and wisdom to slow it down and cushion it with love. 


But yes, I get what you're saying. So moving on with that. So one of the things that. We have to figure out because especially for mamas now who are pregnant, who are having babies, especially compared to when I had my older kids, there wasn't social media. There wasn't these even now, like there's this reverse flip thing of glorifying postpartum. 


The hard side of postpartum where they're showing, their stretch their net panties and the realities where they're showing the realities, but it's still a post picture that has a good filter and yes, she may, [00:20:00] it may be in the real of it, but a lot of moms, they can even take a picture or post it at this point because they're struggling. 


And I think it's really important to have barriers and boundaries I guess I'm trying to figure out what point I'm getting to. I just want you guys to protect what you let in and where you get your information and your guidelines as to what type of mom you should be and the rules or the standards I guess is what I'm saying. 


Would you agree with that? 


Anna: Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I hear you. It's coming from social media. It's coming from your friends It's coming from you know Your friend or your friend's sister who had a baby and their baby slept nine hours at Night from the day they were born. It's coming from all those different places we're putting we're pulling it all in and being like this is what I should feel like. 


And then this is what I should be doing. And my [00:21:00] friend was up and working out again after a week. Why can't I do that? Or my friend's house looks perfect. I should, do that. And then, it also comes from our past. I. I think back, and I think a lot of my guilt comes from the fact that my mom was a stay at home mom. 


And she did. She made breakfast, lunch, and dinner for us every night, every day. She was super involved and, just really amazing. She was a great mom. But I'm a great mom too, and it's just teaching different things, it's, when my kids were sick and my mom would be like you can't go to work. 


And I'm like, she has a little cold, like I have to go to work. I'm a teacher. This is the first day of school, like I'm very heavily relied on, she'll be sicker at some point. Yeah. And I'll want to stay home for that, but she barely has a cold. And so it's yeah, just people, I, [00:22:00] my sister's a stay at home mom also, which. 


Trish: I've done both. So I can 100% say both is hard. And now I've, now I'm doing both at once. 


Anna: Both are hard. Yep. Me too. So I'm the one that drives the kids. 


Trish: So what we're doing right now is bringing you to a deeper level of mom guilt because what our mothers say to us Brings us mom guilt as moms. So what you're saying to your children right now will be in their brains and bringing them mom guilt So be careful It's like a double whammy cuz my mom to like totally there are things that Yeah, and that's just me and my therapist break this down every week, but there are, but so to get away from that, forgive yourself, love yourself, because one thing that I have learned is your children forgive you and love you so much. 


And the most valuable. [00:23:00] thing that I think my children and I have given each other is room to make mistakes and to say I'm sorry and be genuine about it. I can't tell you guys how many times I have gone to my children and I'm like, I'm sorry. Like I, I made a shit move right there. And I'm sorry. And. 


The other thing I've said when they say things, like you said your mom cooked three meals a day, I say, I'm not that kind of mom. Sorry. This is, I'm the kind of mom who will drive you across country, stay gone for eight weeks, take you to Disneyland, do this, do that, I will go to another country and fight to bring you home when I adopt you. 


But I'm not going to make you pancakes and eggs every morning. I just am not that girl. 


Anna: And that's awesome. And I say the exact same things to my kids. Cause they'll be like so and so's mom does this and so's mom does this. And I'm the same. I travel with my kids. I, we've stayed in an RV every summer for a few years. 


Like [00:24:00] we do a lot of cool 


Trish: stuff. I have my strengths and weaknesses. Embrace them like I do. Yeah, 


Anna: and yeah, and I remind my kids of that too, but I think it has to start with. Knowing yourself and I think this often that I'm so glad I worked through these bigger feelings and have been able to talk myself out of feeling bad about having to work or whatever, like having to do anything. 


Oh, no, just because now as the kids are older, when they say that's not fair because so and so this I'm like you know who I am. And no, it is fair, because I do these things, and they don't have to do those things, and, or whatever. 


Trish: Yeah, I totally agree with you, and I think the other thing is, because I had my oldest when I was very young, made so many mistakes, but on the other hand, I did some things good because I was young and I had a [00:25:00] lot of energy. 


And then I had my last one, alt. A whole different story and I've, and I have seven so it's my whole life and I've evolved and changed and I've constantly tried to work on myself and so there are things and that I did when I was a younger mom that now. Just don't matter to me and I've let them go. 


And so I would say my older kids, and one of my sons He's my podcast manager and editor and he's incredible. Thank you Elias He's edits this and he would say 100% That my younger kids are having A different experience in some ways because I allowed myself to grow and I've worked on myself. I can't therapy is like the best thing I've ever done for myself as a woman, as a person, not just a mom, as a person. 


Because I think when you get pregnant, you, [00:26:00] Become one almost with this little person, and it's very hard to pull yourself away from being one with that person forever, like their feelings, their experiences, like you feel such big feelings alongside them, where I think is why we feel so much guilt and put so much pressure on ourselves that the decisions we make and the mistakes we make, and all of those things are going to change everything. 


But the truth of the matter is, yes, they are. But it's also going to form that person mistakes and all form that person and make them who they are. And so I think that what I'm hoping all of you will be able to forgive yourself cause you're going to screw up. You're going to make big mistakes and it's okay. 


It's really okay. 


Anna: And I think it's, even that in itself is a lesson of permission for our kids to grow up and make [00:27:00] mistakes and do the best they can. And some days they're tired and some days they're cranky and some days they're angry and 


Trish: they're human. 


Anna: Yeah. And so are we sometimes. And I, I. I don't know if somebody told me that or if I was reading something, but it really put, set this light bulb in my head of if you're only showing up every single day as this perfect, I'm so happy, I love you so much, and that type of person, you're almost It's teaching your kids that's all you can be and you can't be angry or frustrated. 


Trish: And how do you work through the aftermath of those emotions? I think that's a really important tip, Anna, because I remember someone saying to me, you want your kids to also make big mistakes while they're still living in your home so you can help them navigate those mistakes and the [00:28:00] aftermath of those mistakes. 


When they do, and trust me for those of you guys with little ones, as you navigate the older years and the teenage years, there are going to be things that you're just like heartbroken over, but instead of Looking at that way, okay, how can I help them learn from this so it grows them as a person and they don't do it again, preferably, and I think that's important to you're right I have had friends who never saw their parents argue, who never saw their mom do anything but perfect little happy homemaker, and They have a really hard time navigating their own emotions. 


So that's important. Like my kids see me screw up and I apologize And like i've had the conversation with grayson like I am going to be rude to you sometimes just like you're rude to your sister and your friends sometimes But I love you and we're going to make up and we'll move through that and in fact We had a little spat [00:29:00] yesterday morning like and I'm like, you know what? 


This is a win because he was being a little stinker. I'll be real. We just recently started homeschooling again and he's number one. He's gifted and he's brilliant, which is very difficult to navigate sometimes. And so he we had it out a little bit and then I apologized because. I didn't handle it well. 


I was emotional. I didn't sleep and the night before. And so I apologized to him and he said something precocious. I can't remember, but I come into my office and he had made me breakfast on my desk and it was a plate of three apples and three oranges and a note that said, I love you mom. Turnover, and on the back it said, please 


Anna: enjoy. 


Oh, 


Trish: that's 


so cute. And I was like, you know what, I'm gonna take this as a win. [00:30:00] Because had I not been a little stink to my son, had we not had this little spat, had we not forgiven one another, I wouldn't have had that moment. And I can promise you, I'll never forget walking into my office to this little gift on my desk and this note from him. 


And that's... That's my big tip. It's these things happen, embrace them, find the good, learn your lesson. 


Anna: Yeah, and even that situation, I've had a thousand situations like that with my kids, and even that situation, as you were saying it, it made me realize something about that process with my kids. 


When they're acting Stinkers or naughty or rude or whatever it is, depending on their age, that name changes. Yeah, however I identify it might change. 


Trish: My best friend adopted a little boy and he was like three or four at the time and I found the Funniest [00:31:00] card and it inside it, like it's something like the little asshole or something. 


And I was like, only your best friend can call your child a little asshole. 


Anna: Maybe some family members that you love, but whatever, however they're acting, we can have feelings about that. And when I'm annoyed with my kiddos and they're being naughty and I have feelings about it. And I say I'm just, you stressed me out. 


Like I was, I did all these, interactions with you today that were, I was trying to be positive and. And you just kept pushing me away, or you kept yelling at me, whatever it is. Yeah. They like We're human. Yeah. And they see that, like, when I explain that to them and react to them and let them know that that wasn't okay. 


They're learning, then they have to look inward about that. But if I'm just like super [00:32:00] sugarcoating everything or acting, Oh, that's fine, honey. Yeah, that's not real. Like you can't be like them all the time. Yeah. And I think it's all, it's so intertwined, we feel guilty if we react or have a big reaction to our bigger kids or whatever. 


And sometimes it's part of the learning process and yeah, we're human too and they'll make mistakes and, we're teaching them how to like self talk and apologize and. All of it, even our mistakes, they will learn from. I 


Trish: agree, and I think that's so important to, in the moment, remind yourself that each moment is a lesson for your children. 


This is growing them as a person and for you, and I love that you said that giving yourself permission to like react to them. Like I tell my girls all the time, like those initial first weeks with your baby, there's so much guilt. And I find, especially if you went through [00:33:00] infertility or losses, then you have this baby and this baby is driving you insane because it's crying nonstop. 


It's pooping all over you. Your nipples hurt. You're not getting any sleep. And you feel like. Anger towards the baby or whatever then you have guilt because you're like I wanted this baby So bad, like what kind of monster am I and I'm I tell my mom is no like you're sleep deprived You've got hormones flooding through you and there's no one alive that if they invited a guest into their home And then the guest didn't stop yelling 24 7 and Pooping on the floor or on them or staying up all night. 


They wouldn't have a little bit of strong emotions So like it's okay they are a separate person from you and it's okay to have different emotions towards them and Navigate those and that's fine. It's normal and you're not alone We [00:34:00] there are points and all of us that we feel like god I really don't like my kid right now that It's okay, 


Anna: right? 


And yeah, I see the exact same thing with when it's been a journey for someone. They have this unrealistic expectation that they always have to be grateful and they have to always show appreciation because some of their friends haven't been able to have kiddos yet or. People that are on the same journey, they, they realize how hard it is, but also just that expectation. 


I think what we imagine it to look like, and then the reality of it, there's just like a really big disconnect. I think you imagine. Oh, I'm going to just be so in love with my sweet baby. And they're going to be so adorable. They're going to look so cute in this outfit. And I'm going to take them here and show them to these people. 


Imagine all these things, some of which are true, but there's also a ton of other mixed things in there that [00:35:00] are 


Trish: hard. Yeah. I love that. I love that you brought that up. I think that's so important. And my team and I, cause we just got done with. Fearless Birth Experience. We do this five day free workshops. 


I teach a ton. I think I taught 18 hours altogether, between lives and hanging out and classes. And One of the things that like I told you that's become a huge surprise to us is this postpartum side of the membership and There's something Magical happening with this group of mamas and with my team because we're all moms more majority of us And I was telling them, like I was meeting with my mamas, I went live in there and we were talking and I was like, I don't know how to explain this to these pregnant mamas who are attending Fearless Birth Experience that yes, because they're like, Oh, I can't wait for the membership. 


I'll get the labor [00:36:00] bat signal. I'll have access to a birth nurse and doulas and dah. But then, that then I'll have the baby and that'll be that. I can't, I don't know how to explain to them that, that. That's when you really need us. That's when you really need your community. That's when you really need support. 


Because it doesn't always look the way you think it's gonna look. And it's hard. And it's lonely. It's very isolating. And there's many big emotions involved, and I love my, my postpartum girls we meet every Thursday, and they've connected in a way that I did not see coming, and it's just been really beautiful, and I don't know how to explain that to the outside. 


I don't know how to explain to pregnant moms what's coming. You 


Anna: know, I don't, you can't, one of my best friends just had her first baby at 42. So we feel yeah. And and she has [00:37:00] apologized to me like a hundred times and I love her to death and I went to her birth as her doula and we, visit her often, but she's just Oh my gosh, 


Trish: I can't. 


You just don't know what you 


Anna: don't know. Yeah, I, she's because she was a teacher and she is a teacher, but. You have all these feelings like, oh, I get it, I'm a nanny, or I get it, I'm a nurse, or I get it, I'm a teacher, or I get it, I'm a doula. You don't. I, it's so funny to me too, because we have a lot of doulas on our team that don't have children yet. 


And every single one of them, after they have kids, tells me the same thing. Oh, my gosh. I wasn't as empathetic as I should have been. Like, I can't believe how hard this is. And it is, you can't, it's not something that you can teach somebody. It's like I put birth and having, and raising a baby [00:38:00] in that category of you really don't know until you've done it. 


And there's not many things in life that you can't. imagine yourself and like be empathetic about, but those are two that I'll stand true to that. 


Trish: I, I 100% believe it. And even each birth, Cause I've had six, each birth is so different and I tell them all the time, that's your experience with that baby and it can be so different than the other one, like just so amazing. 


I'm so glad that we had this conversation today. I think it's so important to talk about and to, Feel free to express to others like what you're going through what you're feeling don't leave it just to have this dialogue inside your head Like talk to a friend that you trust if you have if you're one of our members talk to us We'd love to hear from you. 


I'm sure that Anna's [00:39:00] clients have the availability to talk to them and Just don't try to navigate 


Anna: it alone. Nope, that's a huge myth and, one of the things that I hear from families when they're struggling, it's probably the number one thing they say to me is, I thought that I had to do it by myself. 


Other families are doing it by themselves. And I'm like, They're actually not. Everybody has to have support systems and thank you for being such a huge support system to so many families. It is so needed. 


Trish: Thank you so much for coming on today. Can you tell everybody where they can find you? Yeah, you 


Anna: can find me. 


Thank you Also, Trish, but you can find me at Chicago Family Doulas. We, you can call me (312) 765-3012 or email us at chicago family doulas gmail.com. 


Trish: I hope you enjoyed this [00:40:00] episode. This is an important topic. If you haven't realized yet, moms are harsh. If you are a mama who shames other mamas, shame on you. It is not needed. We do it so much internally. This is why I am so passionate about Call Mama Society. My pregnancy and postpartum membership, if you don't know. 


You can get 30 days free inside of our mama membership when you join one of our birth classes Which we love to have you come alongside of us and us come alongside of you I've got me and my doulas. We love you guys, and we love supporting you. There's no mom guilt Allowed we're gonna bolster you we're gonna educate you and we're gonna support you. 


Okay, as always I'll see you again next Friday Bye for now[00:41:00]