The Mother Wound & Its Effect on Postpartum: Maranda Bower

Trish: [00:00:00] My name is Trish Ware and I am obsessed with all things pregnancy and birth and helping you to navigate with the practical and the magical seasons of this journey called motherhood. I'm an all day coffee sipping mama of seven. I've had the amazing privilege of delivering many babies in my 15 plus year career as a labor and delivery nurse and as a mama of seven. 


I'm here to help you take the guesswork out of childbirth so you can make the choices that are right for you and your baby. Quick note. This podcast is for educational purposes only and does not replace your medical advice. Check out our full disclaimer at the bottom of the 


Maranda: show notes. 


Trish: Hello everyone. I am really excited about today's episode and I know I tend to say that, but [00:01:00] today's episode is a topic that I think is going to be extremely Powerful. And just a heads up, I have my allergies are kicked into high gear. So my voice sounds weird, but today's guest is Miranda Bauer and she is the CEO and founder of Postpartum University. 


And all of you guys that hang out with me on the regular know that I am obsessed with postpartum right now because of our postpartum membership. Thank you. Welcome, Miranda. 


Maranda: Thank you so much. I'm very excited to be here. Finally! It's been a long time in the making! I know. 


Trish: Our lives are crazy. 


Miranda and I have been trying to connect for eight I want to say it's close to eight or nine months. It's something 


Maranda: crazy. Absolutely crazy. Yeah. 


Trish: Life is weird sometimes. 


Maranda: And our [00:02:00] schedules have finally aligned and here we are and it's going to be the best episode 


Trish: ever. Ever. Because, that's one thing I love so much about my husband because I tend to be like, even though I focus so heavily on mindset inside of my birth classes and my memberships. 


So the rest of you guys plug your ears. Miranda, I tend to be like an all or nothing, doom or gloom, like immediate reaction type of person. And my husband is. And he's so good at pausing and saying, okay, this means this is the way it's supposed to be and like something good is going to come from it. So he's always like timing is perfect. 


And so he would say. That we didn't connect before because this episode was so meant to be, and it's going to be exactly what was supposed to happen. 


Maranda: I love it so much. And I think we're twinning on husbands because mine is the [00:03:00] exact same way. He's like my rock. I tell him all the time. You're like my emotional rock. 


You keep me stable because I'm the all or nothing too. And yeah I can totally feel that. 


Trish: Yeah, we definitely struggle with that. And just a funny side note, I am trying to start meditating and I'm always like my eight year old can't sit still for two seconds. And so today I did five minutes of meditation, which. 


I realized, I now know why my son cancels till he totally gets it from me. So mindfulness and positive thinking is not my natural go to. So I'm gonna try. So today is going to be amazing, meant to be episode that we've been trying to do for eight months. That's what that is all about. Anyway. So today we're going to talk about the mother wound, which when I was like preparing for this episode over the last eight to nine months. 


I looked at your [00:04:00] website, and I saw an article that you wrote on the mother wound, and I was reading it, and I was like, this makes so much sense to me, and I think, as we were saying before we started recording, that, male, female, whatever. I think we all come into this parenting journey with a lot of wounds. 


So today, we're going to talk about the mother wound. But first, I would love to talk to you about your own birth experiences, because this is the birth experience with Labor Nurse Mama. And everyone who knows me knows I'm obsessed with birth. And I'd love to hear about, briefly, obviously, because the big topic is the mother wound. 


But I would love to hear about your own birth experience and how that brought you into this passion for the postpartum world. 


Maranda: I'd love to share my story. So thank you so much for that, Trish. [00:05:00] I started my journey as a mother 14 years ago. And which is crazy to say, because my son is now towering over me. 


He's large. I've created a man, which is so crazy to feel and to see and to witness. But that started 14 years ago and I now have four children. I had a amazing birth experience with him. I had a home birth, which is not something that most people go into full force. But again, here I am all or nothing, right? 


I wanted that experience. I was terrified of hospitals let's just face it. So I was terrified of hospitals and I didn't feel like I had much of any other choice at hand and it was an incredible experience. But nothing could really prepare you for that, right? I felt 14 years ago, this is not something, we didn't have online memberships. 


We didn't have community spaces like that, [00:06:00] we didn't have that stuff. And so I, I'm reading all the books, I'm doing all the research. I was a biology student at the time. So I thought I knew 


Trish: everything. Wait let's. Let's stop for a second. For those of you guys who don't know, back then we had these buildings that you had to drive to, and park, and walk into, and they housed these things called books. 


Maranda: You're making me look really old here. No, 


Trish: My oldest is in his thirties. So I totally understand, 


Maranda: right? And so I thought I had prepared for everything and then his experience came and really, I learned how unprepared I was and we have a tendency, I feel. That we do birth how we do life and that's exactly how I did. 


All are all in, I was ready for gung ho. And then when you get to the hard part, I was like, I'm out, I'm dropping this. I'm leaving. I specifically remember saying to [00:07:00] my midwife, I'm done. And of course, my, my baby, I'm like in transition. My baby's coming. I don't have a choice. And she was like, honey, you're exactly where you're supposed to be. 


You're going to birth this baby. And I did, and I remember 17 hours of labor, 2 hours of pushing and. The most difficult thing I have ever experienced in my entire life, but when I was done and I had my baby boy in my arms, I looked at every single person in that room, tears streaming down my face and I said, I did it. 


I did it. I did it. And I remember looking in the eyes of every single person as I said that to each individual Did you see that? Did you witness what I just accomplished? And I really feel like that was the beginning of my inner knowing of who I am and what I'm coming here to be. And so I I loved All Things Birth. 


Again, I was, inundated with it, like in my pregnancy, I [00:08:00] wanted to know all of the things. And then here was my experience. And then two weeks later. I am a giant mess. I am crying at everything, I haven't slept, my nipples are bleeding, I cannot understand why I don't even want to be a mom anymore. 


And depression hit me like a ton of bricks. I was so prepared, or what I thought I was, prepared for the labor and the birth, but not prepared in the least bit. bit for how to heal my body afterward, I had no freaking clue. And that's really how postpartum university has come to fruition. Because as I was looking at, okay, I have depression. 


I had extreme anxiety. I would wake up from a nap. Having dreamt of [00:09:00] monkeys coming down from the ceiling to steal my baby and waking up in a huge panic attack, knowing that was completely not going to happen not understanding what my, what was going on with my brain, but not able to control the situation in the least bit, just like freaking out full on panic attacks. 


So I knew something had to give something had to change. I could not raise my son. In that way, it was not going to happen. I had to do something more. I had to do something different for him. And I really started my journey into, okay, how do I heal my body? Why did this happen to me in the first place? 


I was talking with providers. I was talking with my sister, my, my best friends, my the people in my space, and it was like, yeah, this is motherhood. Yeah, this is the way it goes. And my doctors were like, of course, you just had a baby. This is how it is. They had no clue. They had no [00:10:00] idea. 


They had no training. They had no background. It, my, my friends my loved ones who've been there before, they were just like, yeah, it's crappy. Here you are. Welcome to motherhood. And I was like, holy crap. How we have normalized this mediocre motherhood, This crappy experience and still to this day, this is what we do right now. 


We're coming out and we're talking about postpartum depression and anxiety, but under the same breath, we've normalized it. We've said this is the normal thing to experience. And that's so far from the truth. That's not how we're supposed to experience motherhood. That's not how life is supposed to be. 


So this is why postpartum university exists so that we can understand what it truly means, what's happening in our bodies. What are the physiological changes, the psychological changes, the biological changes, and then how do we support them so that we feel good? in our [00:11:00] bodies and we heal well so that we can be the mothers that we want. 


I love 


Trish: that so much. That's amazing. As a labor and delivery nurse, postpartum has always been beside my own. It's not really been my passion because, I labor you and then I recover you for two hours and I pass you on to a postpartum nurse. So besides my own postpartum experience, and you know from being a mom of four, I'm a mom of seven, your postpartum journey in real life, and I say that in quotes, is It's usually very lonely. 


You don't spend it with other people. Your friends who are having babies, even if they're having babies at the same time, they're doing it alone. You don't have time to do it together and you don't have the energy to do it together. It's not like you want to, especially [00:12:00] the more kids you have, it's not like you want to get all the kids in the car and go over to your friend's house and recover over there or vice versa. 


So it's a very lonely journey. And like you said, for those of us who have older kids, we didn't have the resources that the moms have today. And I love that pregnancy and postpartum. 


I do feel like we're moving into an era where we're saying, no, you don't have to be in pain during pregnancy. You don't have to say this is just a normal part of pregnancy and no, you don't have to be overwhelmed and you don't have to be sad and you don't have to feel all these feelings. 


There are things available to you to get help during postpartum. I'm glad that we're moving towards that. But like you said. There are still a lot of people who are suffering and suffering alone. And that is overwhelming to me as I, as a [00:13:00] professional. And I just love that there are so many of us who are saying enough. 


In taking action and, inside of our membership, which began as a pregnancy membership, but guess what? They had their babies and they're sticking around. So we started our, our weekly postpartum hanger hangout, and that has morphed into this incredible postpartum in environment and through these women and their transparency. 


My youngest is eight out of seven children, but the things that these women have shared, Miranda, has been the first time that I've been like, oh my gosh I felt that. I went through that. That's normal. Other people felt that. I wasn't crazy. That is something common. Because in real life, with your real [00:14:00] friends, you don't have the courage to say, I saw monkeys coming down from the ceiling to steal my baby. 


You just don't talk about that stuff. 


Maranda: And then I had a panic attack over it. Yes. 


Trish: Yes. 


Maranda: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. We don't share these stories enough. We don't have safe spaces to do that. And, 


Trish: and besides that, you're exhausted and if you happen to have the privilege of going to get coffee with your friend who also has babies and you're sitting there and you're looking at her and you think she has it together and you feel that you don't, which chances are she doesn't either, you're not going to tell her that on the way over you pictured running your car into a tree. 


With your babies in the car because you don't know what's going to happen from that point on, but you did and you're scared because of it. 


Maranda: And we all sit in [00:15:00] silence because our other friend who's sitting right next to us had a very similar experience when she was walking down the stairs to come see you. 


And she dreamt, thought about throwing her baby over the balcony and a very horrific scene. And she's keeping that to herself. As you were keeping it to yourself, right? Yes. Yeah, 


Trish: absolutely. Yeah. And that's what I have found in, and the thing that I want all of you guys to hear is Miranda and I both have postpartum memberships and I 100% I invite other women who have. 


birth classes, and Miranda has a postpartum membership, and I have a postpartum membership, and there's space for all of us, because there are billions of women who are having babies, and we all need community, and we all need support, and I one hundred percent. believe in [00:16:00] online community because there are things we can say in an online support group that we would never say to a person sitting in a room with us because we're too afraid. 


And I've been able to say, my family's going through hell right now, like a real life experience that I have no one to talk to in. real life besides my attorneys, and so I've been able to share things with these moms that know things intimately about my life and they have shared things with me. 


And like what we were just talking about, for those of you guys who are pregnant, you're going to think and feel things that your brain will say, don't. Tell, don't speak it, don't even tell your partner, but they are things that women all over the world are feeling. And I had a guest [00:17:00] recently. That was talking about intrusive thoughts in particular, and these thoughts of harm. 


And the way she explained it, and I'm probably not going to do justice, I am the world's worst paraphraser, or worse, but she was talking about these particular types of thoughts and she said, it is actually a way in which our brain is walking through safety. Situations, and so for instance, going down the stairs, every one of my moms in my postpartum membership has had that type of throwing the baby over the side of the stairs, rolling down the stairs, throwing the baby down the stairs type of vision type of thing. 


And it's the way she explained it is part of it is our brain. What if? What if I slipped? What if I fall? What if I, like it's a walking through the what ifs, not necessarily like I hate this baby, I'm going to throw this baby type of thing, it's part [00:18:00] of that. 


Maranda: I want to share like, this is your nervous system on overdrive and a part of that is a biological normal because you're here to protect that baby. 


And so anytime there's a dangerous situation where you're getting in a car, you're going down the stairs, you're coming across, a balcony, whatever that sit situation is, or that scenario is, your brain is notifying you that, Hey, this might be a dangerous thing, but we live in a world that is so full of information that's so full of stress, right? 


You've gotta do this, you've gotta do that, and your postpartum body. And I'm not talking about the six weeks postpartum. I'm talking about like the years postpartum here. Your brain is literally, it takes two full years for your brain to go through the entire process of changing, right? So these intrusive thoughts, they live with you for a while because it's [00:19:00] simply saying, Hey your body's on overdrive. 


You, you've got to, you've got to calm down and bring it back into the wholeness that you already are. And it's hard to do when we live in this stress environment, when we're constantly on the go and we have so many things happening within our world and and things on our mind and to do lists and all of that is what creates those intrusive thoughts. 


The biological normal is, Hey, I'm protecting my baby, but when we're so stressed and so overwhelmed, it's like it flips it over the edge. Now it becomes almost unmanageable. And then those thoughts become scary. So always reminding yourself like, Hey I'm only thinking these things because I'm here to protect my baby. 


My brain is doing such a good job and bringing yourself back into your body, deep breaths, breathing, right? Relaxing into that and recognizing that you're doing the hard work, right? That is exactly what you're supposed to do. And I think that just [00:20:00] takes away the spiral because I know that when I had my intrusive thoughts and I see this all the time and with my mom is as well, it's You feel it. 


And then you're like, Oh my gosh, I can't believe I just had that thought. I'm a terrible mom. Why is that happening? And then you feel shamed about it. You feel guilty for it. And it sends you in a bigger spiral. And you have those thoughts more often because you're so stressed out about it. But the nervous system is on high, right? 


Like it's a nasty spiral. So think yourself, right? Like I got it. My body's doing such a good job letting me know that there's danger and. It's okay. I'm safe. My baby's safe. I've got this. It's just so much. It's like a whole shift in, in perspective. 


Trish: Yeah. And I love that because for most women, the only counsel you get is inside your own brain because you're too afraid to share it or speak it. 


There's so much power in speaking it and [00:21:00] sharing it and hearing, Oh, I'm not alone. Someone else has felt that and finding out like this is normal for me to think this and this is a part of like You said my system my body protecting my baby not harming my baby And I just love that power in that. 


Okay, so let's talk about the mother wound What the heck is the mother wound? What is it? The 


Maranda: mother wound. Yes. I love this conversation. The mother wound is something that I find is often experienced by all of us, especially our generation, our mother's generation, even the generations before. It's really this emotional and psychological scarring almost that women carry as a result of their relationship with their own mothers. 


So the things that we've experienced in childhood relating to our mothers, the physical, the emotional, maybe a neglect, [00:22:00] abandonment lack of love or support loss of our mothers, all of those things can often cause what we call the mother wound and it impacts the way we ourselves mother, right? 


Our very first. Idea of what mother mothering is comes from the way in which we were mothered and the way we would, and which we experienced that mothering. And so often when we become others. That's the very thing that starts popping up. I always call these things invitations to heal. So when you have an intrusive thought, when you have a remembrance of a trauma, when you experience something in your body that does not feel good. 


Those are called invitations to heal. And that's exactly what the motherhood is. It's these invitations to [00:23:00] heal what has transpired within your own childhood, within your own mother, mothering journey, so that you can heal. And it's generational healing too. You're not just healing for yourself, but for your children and be the mom that you've always wanted to be, what you've actually envisioned being and changing that, that whole generational paradigm. 


It 


Trish: just, it makes so much sense that our mothers have such a profound effect. on our mothering, right? It's just, it makes so much sense. And I've been doing a lot of self reflection and learning through therapy and mothers have such a power. We have such a huge power. And I think for everyone, and especially those of you who are expecting and entering into this journey, I am 100% on board for [00:24:00] therapy, whether you think you need it or not. 


If you're becoming a parent, trust me, you need it. It is such a valuable tool. Learning how to communicate and you're about to grow emotionally and physically and nurture another human being like therapy is amazing. 


Maranda: It is. And when it, when we're talking about the mother wound, there's so many aspects of this. 


That really impact our life, our low self esteem, beating ourselves up, the self doubt, the insecurity that, that impacts your relationships. It impacts your career, your sense of self worth and obviously how you parent, then we have depression and anxiety that also interweaves themselves into those components and it can make it worse to, and more likely to explode. 


experience those things. And then [00:25:00] we have a really difficult time forming those healthy relationships whether it's not just with our baby, but also with our partner, right? How did we witness our mother being a wife, right? And how do we carry on so much of that? I was actually just at the retreat recently. 


And it was a beautiful gathering of these amazing women. We were it was a business retreat, but there's okay, business retreat also means like deep healing retreat, like tons of inner work. We were doing all sorts of amazing healing sessions and the recognition of so many women were like, Whoa, I did not realize that I was. 


I didn't realize that I was carrying this wound that I had from childhood over into the way I was parenting. I didn't realize that I was doing XYZ based upon The experience they had of [00:26:00] being mothered and I took that away wow, this is so incredible. We don't recognize how deep this is for us. And the thing is, and I want to say no matter where you are, like I hear so many people say now I'm just terrified to mother. 


Because I'm just going to leave some scar on my kid, no matter what I do. Because I could be the perfect mother and it sounds like I'm still going to have something go out or go wrong. And it, and I want to stress the significance of just doing. Your absolute best like our children have their journeys just as you have your journey We're here to heal and to grow right? 


So we're our children and we can't protect them for it from everything But I promise you the more that you work on your mother wound The more that you focus on healing your body and releasing that ancestral and generational trauma, the better off [00:27:00] everyone will be, especially as the center of your home as the creator of your home, right? 


Like you have, you create human beings, right? You are literally the center of the world. You are the center of your home, the energetic center, the mother's so many aspects. This is why the motherhood is so big. Because you are, you play such a huge role and that's why it's so important that. 


We work on these things and you heal your body, focus on yourself because when you focus on healing yourself and you give yourself permission to do that inner work, to focus on the things that really matter for you, not just the inner work, but also nutrition, getting enough sleep, communicating with your husband, having some sexy time, having some time alone, meditating, yes, that you need, That is going to simultaneously [00:28:00] meet the needs of your children, and we often forget that we think the opposite. 


If I neglect myself, if I am a martyr to my own wellbeing, if I ignore everything about what I need and just give everything to my children, they will benefit. And the truth is that's not what we want them to see because that is only creating a mother wound for them. If they're watching you give so much of yourself that you're falling apart, then they're gonna believe that is what motherhood is and they're gonna feel guilty and shameful for that, having given you that experience. 


I see this all the time as a person who's grown up with a mother myself, my mother was constantly sick. And when I grew up and became a mother, I thought motherhood meant illness. And I tell you, I didn't find that until I started [00:29:00] meditating. So maybe you'll find something there. But I, that came to me in a meditation. 


It was absolutely, I was blown away. I was like, Oh my gosh, no wonder. I'm always sick because my mom gave so much of herself that she would crash and crash and crash. And I thought that's what it meant to be a mother. And so guess what? I was repeating. And when I recognized that. It changed my whole world. 


I was like, I don't have to give myself to an, in such a way to make myself sick. And now my children witness a happy, healthy mother who's able to be there for them more when it matters. Because I'm more available. I'm not sick. I'm not, hung up on the couch or in the bathroom or whatever it is. 


What 


Trish: happens when the host of the podcast starts crying? I know, 


Maranda: I know I'm able to be there for [00:30:00] them and because I've taken time out for myself. And I, what I'm saying is meet the needs of your children by first giving to yourself. And it's so cliche put your mask on first, right? 


We say that, and it's just one of those extra things. 


Trish: But it's a huge struggle as a mother. I talk to my girls all the time inside of our membership and with my students because one of the, one of the things that sets me apart from all other birth classes, number one, if they join our birth classes, they get 30 days free and call mama society, which is my pregnancy and postpartum membership. 


Part of that, which is literally insane, but relationship is My thing I thrive on that. So we give them virtual labor support Which means they get this private DM with me and my two doulas once they hit 37 weeks up until Literally whenever [00:31:00] as long as they're a member inside the membership But part of what we do is they start their labor. 


We call it labor bat signal They started at 37 weeks and they're always focused on. How do I go into labor? How do I go into labor? But one of our primary goals is How do you focus on you these last few weeks because we want them to start practicing? their importance as a woman Before baby comes so that they continue that after baby comes and we're like, okay, what, let's say her name is Jenny. 


What does Jenny love to do that she's not going to be able to do once baby comes? We want you to do that once or twice these last few weeks. What is something you really love to do? Like we want to, we want you to do it and we're going to hold you accountable because as well as I know once baby comes, even if you get to do it. 


It's not the same. [00:32:00] And so then after baby comes, we really want them to focus on prioritizing that. And just to be transparent I got out of a pretty abusive relationship in 2019. And part of why I focus on this is because of just what you said. Like I ran myself. And not only did I not know how to take care of myself, but my kids had no idea what it looked like for me to have boundaries. 


And, I've shared this before. I remember saying to my therapist is it okay for me to shut my door and watch a movie by myself? Is that selfish? And she was like, no, that is completely okay. And just watching a movie by myself without the kids and saying, Hey, don't interrupt. I'm going to hang out and have a glass [00:33:00] of wine, watch a movie was so huge for me, but that was because of me. 


Because I had not set those boundaries. I had not prioritized myself. I was just like your mom. I dropped everything for them, and I had set that up. So I have made it a priority to try to teach these mamas to start it in pregnancy. That I, yeah, focus on you. You're valuable. And if you do, Guess what? 


Your partner and your children will also value you. 


Maranda: Mic drop, done, right? Podcast over. That is such a perfect scenario. And I talk about this all the time, especially when it comes to Mother's Day. I actually have written several pieces and talked about this multiple times. It's celebrate yourself first, and then you set the standard. 


Like you let other people know how to treat you. You [00:34:00] are creating an atmosphere in which you are going to thrive. You have to do that first, however, and that's the hardest part because so many women are like I don't even know where to start. I don't even know how to take care of myself. We don't even know, we don't even talk about how to eat to heal your body. 


We don't talk about how to get the best sleep with a newborn. We talk about how to make newborn sleep and sleep training, but we don't talk about ourselves, right? We talk about how do we lose the baby weight? We don't talk about how do I be the healthiest version of myself. We have completely neglected some of these important aspects of who we are and I see it all the time too. 


It's Oh, try this. And Oh, try that. And it's Hey, guess what? That doesn't work for a postpartum body. Like that you have to understand what's really transpiring within you. What's really physically and emotionally changing and how to use that to your benefit. And so that's where [00:35:00] my focus is, right? 


My mama thrive method is really about helping you understand those intricacies within you so that you know how to support them best. And I see this all the time. And you probably do too, because you work with so many mamas. They're like, I don't even know. Where to begin, where do I start my life is so overwhelming. 


I have so much on my plate. Like the very idea of doing anything is way too much. Where do you start? And so breaking it down to help them understand here are. Exactly where you want to start to get the best results so that you can start feeling like you again and your body. And I think that's just such a huge shift in mindset to be able to say, Oh, take care of you. 


But what happens when we take care of you? Okay, here's an example for you. Real life scenario. How many times do you actually get a moment to yourself? If you do, you get a moment to yourself and you're like, I have no earthly [00:36:00] idea of what to do right now. You're completely lost. And by the time the 15 minutes are up or the hour or two are up, you have done zero except for think about what to do. 


Yeah. And you're like, okay, what? 


Trish: I've accomplished nothing. I have 


Maranda: done nothing, right? Like you haven't even rested, right? Because you've been, oh my gosh, what do I do? The, thinking and thinking and the anxiety over what to do and it's gone. And that's what we see so often. 


So eliminating that completely you don't have to do anything just show up in this space. Here's step one, nourish yourself in this way. And then let's move on to the next and let's have these conversations. Let's start talking about these invitations to heal, right? And start looking at how we can get you feeling good again in your body. 


Trish: I, and I love just moving back to the mother wound. [00:37:00] One thing that I was thinking when you were talking about that, because I, like I said, I spend a lot of time with my LNM mamas inside of Kaw Mama Society. A lot of time. I know them very well. So I know their relationships with their mothers. 


It is a huge struggle for us as women who have difficulties with our mothers to set boundaries or to say enough and to not allow them space, maybe, in their, in our lives because when you have a toxic mother. It doesn't just stop because you're a grown woman. So what do you say to the mamas that you have relationship with that they're still being wounded by their mother, but now [00:38:00] they are bringing a child into the world? 


You know what I'm saying? Oh, wait. This 


Maranda: is like a whole new podcast show right here. 


Trish: Yeah. So because. That doesn't stop when you become an adult woman and when you become a parent yourself And I know one of the things that we talk about in our pregnancy hangout we you know, we hang out with our pregnant mamas every Wednesday and You know that starts to look out I want to be in your birth room and I'm gonna come when you have the baby and here's how you Parent and you should be doing this or you should be breastfeeding or you should have an epidural or you should go unmedicated. 


There's a lot of bossiness and there's a lot of you shoulds and, just a lot more wounding. So what is, what, what is your thought on that? Like, how do they create boundaries? And is there a time and a place to say enough and you can't have space in my life any longer? 


Maranda: Yeah, all of the above. 


And again, I think this is such an intricate [00:39:00] conversation that can go on for again, another entire podcast episode. But those boundaries really need to start now if they haven't started at all. And it is going to have to be those difficult conversations, they have to take place. And I think that's sometimes the hardest is that we need to have those difficult conversations. 


And then we need to hold those conversations in place, right? We need to have those boundaries. And so when we have, a mom who is toxic and she's coming at us with all of these things that you need to do this and you need to do that, or. Whatever it is in your situation, right? Narcissism is running high these days. 


We have a lot of things that are transpiring. And if that is occurring in your life, you need to say this will not happen again. And if it does. Here's what I'm doing and it's this. This is how we lay boundaries down. I see it all the time where moms are like I am [00:40:00] going to lay boundaries by saying this can't happen. 


And if it does, then you're going to be responsible for this. And it's no, that doesn't work. You have to take responsibility for it, whether it's blocking their phone number. Changing the locks on your door, whatever the case is, if you need to do that, even for a short time to, to prove your point this is my boundary. 


If this occurs, this is what I'm going to have to do about the situation, right? My husband's going to have to step in. I'm going to have to do X, Y, Z, whatever it is, make that happen. If you're in such a relationship that is so toxic. You have no other choice, right? You have to do that for yourself. And here's one of the reasons why the, your body and postpartum is incredibly sensitive. 


And it's so sensitive because we have a lot going on with in our brains, right? Are the [00:41:00] neuroplasticity of our brains changes significantly. So not only are you wired to be able to take care of your baby more and to be able to connect with your baby more and to be able to sense danger more, right? 


You're also remaking all of those new neuron connections in your body. And so it's really important that if you're faced with danger, that you make sure you're putting a stop to that, or you're letting your body know that it's okay, I have this under control. Or if someone is telling you're not doing it right, or you're not good enough, or whatever the scenario is, you're literally rewiring your brain to believe that. 


And so you have to put an end to it. Someone has to, whether it's somebody on your side, your partner, your spouse, whomever, your best friend, or you putting an end to it and saying, no, this is a protected space. My brain is changing so much [00:42:00] right now. And I cannot become a mother who believes that about myself. 


I cannot be a mother who takes this as a normal. I cannot be a mom who goes through this on the regular. So making sure that those boundaries are set and then actually following through with those boundaries. I think that's the big thing, right? If you're going to talk to me in this way, I'm sorry, but I can't invite you over to my house to help me anymore, right? 


I need you to be here to encourage me. I need you to tell me I'm doing a good job. I need you to show up in this way. And if that can't happen, then this cannot happen. And being very clear. And again, this is like an entire podcast episode. I can go on and on. But like the most pertinent thing that you need to know is that there's some big changes happening within you and you deserve to make sure that those are, those changes are protected.[00:43:00] 


So that you can be the mom that you want to be. And I'm going to tell you a quick story too. I struggled with boundaries. I think we all do as women. A lot of that comes from the mother wound. And I remember deciding that I was going to make some boundaries for myself. And I had told my children one day that I was going to go take some time out. 


My kids are now almost 14, he's about to turn 14, nine, seven, and four. Okay. So I have a range of children. And this was right when my daughter, my youngest was two, I believe. And so they're all still young. And I was like, I need some quiet time. I need some time to myself and I'm going to go into my room and I'm going to be there and I will let you know when I'm ready. 


To be out of my room and I came out and I remember feeling so calm and so peaceful. And my kids were like, are you okay, mom? And I was like, I'm great. And they were like [00:44:00] I'm great. You're great. That felt really good. Cause now I'm able to be present. And so it ended up becoming a thing where my kids were like, mom, do you need some time alone? 


Do you need some time by yourself? And now my children do the exact same thing. My daughter will sense herself. She starts getting angry and upset. And she's I need to go take some time. I'll be back and she'll walk away and she'll go take time for herself. And sometimes they'll ask me to come with them. 


Can you help me? Because we're co regulating. They need that co regulation, which is totally normal and natural. And I'm like, hands down, I'll be right there with you. Walking them through that. But it's wonderful to see them setting their own boundaries and to listening to their bodies. I will tell you sometimes it backfires, right? 


Like where we were sitting at the dinner table just the other day. And my daughter was like, yeah, I'm listening to my body. And I really just don't want this food. [00:45:00] And it's okay. But they are so connected. I have three girls and I'm so grateful that I get to raise them in this way. And I'm sure there's mess ups. 


I'm sure they're going to end up in therapy for something or other. I'm not going to be afraid of that. I'm going to keep healing myself. I'm going to keep working through this generational mother wound. And taking care of myself, knowing that I am simultaneously meeting and caring for my babies and showing them how to do the same for themselves. 


I 


Trish: love that. Same thing with Grayson. He'll do the same thing. He'll be like, I need some time alone. I need to go and think and calm down. I'm like, okay, do it. Therapy is amazing. 


Maranda: How empowering is that for our children? I never got that, right? Me neither. No, never. And I know my mom never 


Trish: got that, right? 


And my mom wouldn't have handled that. She would have taken it personally had I [00:46:00] done that 


Maranda: when I was younger. Exactly, right? And so we don't have to do that. We don't have to play those games. We can have boundaries and feel good about them and recognize. How beneficial they are to our children. 


Trish: Yeah. I love that. I, this has been such a great conversation. I feel like we could go on and on because I, and it's funny every time I post something on Labor Nurse Mama about boundaries or toxic family members or toxic friends, it literally goes viral because I think so many of us are dealing with these wounds. 


Whether it's a mother, or a family member, or father, or what have you, but a lot of times it is a mother or a mother in law. One or the other. So Miranda, can you tell everyone where they can find you? Absolutely. 


Maranda: So you can go to my website, postpartumu, that's the letter u dot com, and we have a podcast as well. 


We talk about all of these things. We have a blog. We [00:47:00] have Social media, you can go follow us on. And of course we have our own amazing membership where I walk you through the thrive mama method and help you connect in with those physical changes, those psychological changes that are occurring. And we also work a lot with postpartum professionals. 


That's a. The huge part of what we do. So if you're in the field, if you're a doctor, nurse, midwife, we can have chiropractors, nutritionists doctors, of course. The field, right? If you are working with postpartum moms, this is a safe place where you can come in and not only get the healing that you need, but also the training that you need to understand those physiological and psychological changes. 


So things that no one else is talking about. We talk about that at postpartum university. So you're welcome to join us. 


Trish: Oh, I love it. Thank you so much for coming today. It was amazing conversation. Trish, 


Maranda: it is such a pleasure. And I'm so glad that we were finally able to connect. I feel like this [00:48:00] is like the birth of a baby, right? 


It's been eight, nine months of waiting and connecting in and trying to make this work. And here it is the birth of a baby. So it happens. 


Trish: Thank you. 


Maranda: Yes, of course. 


Trish: Today's episode was such a powerful episode for me as a woman and a mother. Mother wounds are significant. So I hope you enjoyed listening to it and I'd love to hear your feedback. So leave a review, hit subscribe so that you always get a heads up on a new episode. They come out every Friday morning. As always, see you again next Friday. 


Bye 


Maranda: for now.